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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 9:41 am 
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Xeeron wrote:
As it is not in the list of changes above, I will assume this is a bug:

1.) You can not attack outposts of players in vacation mode

2.) You can not attack relics of players in vacation mode

No1 is bad, but No2 is horrible and needs to be changed ASAP to prevent abuse.

Apart from the bugs, a very decent update.

- Xeeron


Umm, well it has ALWAYS, since the game first began, been true that you can't attack outposts of vacationing players. As for relics on vacation, that's a toughie. I'd say give temporary ownership to someone else and leave it in play. Because its true it can and will abused if you allow the relics to be untouchable when its owner goes on vacation.

Also for the people complaining about the training limit, it's not a new idea. I don't know how long ago they got rid of it, but that too was around since the beginning of battledawn. Sure it was nice not having the limit, but consider it a blast from the past.


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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 11:10 am 
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kelden wrote:


2) Training limit - this is just incredibly silly. When I first noticed the limit I figured - hey maybe I can build more barracks like in other games! Nope, I couldn't. I see absolutely no logic behind this decision

Sure some might say this is a good thing, that it shouldn't be a hobby you can spend just a couple of minutes every day on. I find this mindset quit boggling, so good players that are low on time shouldn't have a chance? Is the game only for people with no other time consuming responsibilities? I am fairly sure I read somewhere that this game was supposed to be something you could log on once or twice a day and still do decently. When did that goal change?


ok ..so i guess Hives just got a lot bigger .., everyone will have a dozen training base's around their colonys ..except your only allowed to build one ?
im sure ppl. will find a way ..

i guess ppl. that lead busy lifes , and only log in once or twice a day will lose interest , not much you can do with 1 squad against your conquerers . or even think about competing unless your like me and have a lot of idle time on your hands .
i guess i should thank BD for this ... my competition dosent stand a chance against me now ...i practicaly live on Battle dawn :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 11:33 am 
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RunnerChase wrote:
i guess i should thank BD for this ... my competition dosent stand a chance against me now ...i practicaly live on Battle dawn :lol:


It's not even a question of logging on once or twice a day, you can't even sleep properly without loosing resources. If you really dislike competition that much, I heard single player games have cheat codes. They can be found at www.gamefaq.com


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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 11:53 am 
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kelden wrote:
Well don't I feel noobish coming here with my second post ever, oh well. Most Kong players don't come to the bd.com forums, heck they barely use the BD forums on Kong so I figured I might as well voice some complaints. I am not claiming this is everyones opinion, but it feels fairly consistent amongst the top (ie usually most active) players.

1) The resource limit - it's my understanding that the resource limit was always supposed to be in place. It is however extremely frustrating, let's assume I have a decent income of 2000/tick, so I'd need to log on every 7 ticks.

1 tick world - Every 7 hours.
2 tick world - Every 3 hrs 30 mins.
3 tick world - Every 2 hrs 20 mins.
6 tick world - Every 1 hr 10 mins.

Sure I can increase the limit to 30000, which I usually do because I hate micromanaging the resources but that would still mean sleeping for less than 2 1/2 hours on a speed world and less than 5 hours on a 3 tick world. This is assuming I have 2000 per tick, it's not hard to have a larger income that that.

2) Training limit - this is just incredibly silly. When I first noticed the limit I figured - hey maybe I can build more barracks like in other games! Nope, I couldn't. I see absolutely no logic behind this decision, the only thing it achieves game play wise is making heavies even worse. I can now train 90 inf compared to 10 heavies. Sorry but hindering boosters is hardly an issue, you can still rush units or just wait 2 ticks. If you want to spam ranged, that's 6000 per squad without overhead. If you boost you can make 46000 over 144 ticks, that averages out to ~320 per tick. Sure it might hinder them slightly, but they can still rush.

3) Advisors and music - Ooooh pretty shiny new toys! Though they are fairly pointless, I'd rather see new features that actually add things (like the long wanted global vacation) or fixing bugs which bring me to my next point.

4) Bugs - I managed to reproduce the wreck bug pretty much instantly. I managed to select a colony in vacation though I haven't managed to with a missile. Might be that I just gave up, it's a bother with a mousepad.

5) Achievements - Meh, would be nice if they worked but doesn't really matter. It's pretty cool having 300+ power and rank 1 without having conquered a single colony.

In both the worlds I'm playing I had a member doing pretty well, rank 1 on M1 and rank 3 on M3. The second he realised the changes he quit the alliances and asked us to conquer him, his reason? The change of focus from strategy to micromanagement. The real change this update presents is really rewarding those that are active.

Sure some might say this is a good thing, that it shouldn't be a hobby you can spend just a couple of minutes every day on. I find this mindset quit boggling, so good players that are low on time shouldn't have a chance? Is the game only for people with no other time consuming responsibilities? I am fairly sure I read somewhere that this game was supposed to be something you could log on once or twice a day and still do decently. When did that goal change?

Maybe I'm stupid but I'd rather see changes that enhances game play or fixes the bugs properly. If that can't achieved, couldn't at least the units be balanced?

This guy has voiced out all my concerns for the changes perfectly... Andrew please please talk to Michael about these changes! Battledawn was a game that you can play by only logging on at least twice a day. That was your slogan even way back in OC. Right now you guys are driving away people or hindering them from spending money on the game because of some of these changes. Although I personally do not donate, I would understand why regular donaters wont even bother donating anymore. And also most of us have a lot of things to do in real life. The updates battledawn just gone through requires players who have [color=#BF0000]NO LIFE[/color] like seriously.

After painstakingly reading through 8+ pages of this thread Andrew you know what is really wrong with some of the updates.. Also check E1 guy with relics is on vacation and his relics are on vacation as well LOL

Andrew PLEASE clear that up

cheers

-Marco of Your Worst Nightmare


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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:39 pm 
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I'm going to address several posts in individual posts, hopefully the mods will forgive what is about to be a quintuple post and not ban me :mrgreen:.

Cursedboy wrote:
Ok first of all that was quite a decent update fixing many things.
I believe bugs are still in need to be fixed and i hope we can have every aspect of this update working as fast as possible.

My feedback and notes so far :

1) Have the score tha relics give changed ? I see people with relics in better rankings without change in power or crystals.
No, score calculations were not changed.

2) I also agree that the unit experience is missing from this game and i hope we see it again on the next update.
I've brought this up to our head programmer to ensure that it is put in in the next update and I have added it to our list in the highest priority.

3) Why do u people keep complaining about the 30 soldiers recruiting limit ? IT is about time this game gets a bit more challenging than an 10 minute hobby a day. U can make so many units without having to be active to conquer others etc it is time that it at least requires to spend some time on it. Very good add on my opinion.
A limit on unit training will stay but adjustments to this will come into play based on feedback and balancing.

4) My comment on the overhead is that should not be removed. I know it is hard but let's face it unit numbers has increased so much that it gets ridiculous on some point at least u should pay the fact that u can have a huge army.
Overhead for now is staying as is but for the next update I'm looking at tweaks to overhead due to the massive cost of replenishing units and am still considering a cap.

5) Also could we get the alliance chat get faster updated so that it becomes a lot more usefull ?
The alliance chat updates based on your activity, if you haven't written anything in a while it can be delayed 5-10 seconds or so, if you have written something in the last few minutes and have a green status then it will update every second. There were issues that arose in testing when using a full live chat so we had to go with this polled method instead for at least the time being.

6) Since the resourche cap has been fixed maybe u should consider to increase it to at least 20k default. I mean 15k is practically half a day production for some people so it would make them lose lots of resourches in just a few hours offline the game.
This is a good point and we'll consider it, with resource production now not able to get you over the cap and trading to get over the cap removed it may be a good idea to raise the resource limit to 20k and 40k with the increased cap so top 5 alliances in faster worlds can sleep.

7) I wanted also to ask something very important. I understand that u cannot buy workers if u are over 1000 and it's a good thing but why people having more than 1000 workers lost them ? I mean u still can have over 1000 if u buy some or raze outposts. Why did we lose the workers we had worked so hard to get when there is not an update that indicates that we can no longer have more than 1000 workers.
There was a bug that resulted in some users getting thousands of workers and being put massively over the cap. Unfortunately it was too widespread and we couldn't apply a targeted fix so we had to lower anyone who had over 1000 workers to the 1000 worker cap. Please message the admin for compensation in the world this happened.

8) Also i don't know if it is a server problem or a bugg but i still don't get simple achievements after the rest like conquer a colony or an outpost although i have done these things. U should look into it to see what happens.
There are some issues with achievements right now we're looking into.

9) AT last a battle calculator (after it works properly) is a great add and a necessary tool so thanks for that.
Yeah this is a neat little feature, really helps to test out battles before hand and this uses the in-game battle system so the results should be 100% accurate to a real battle now.

In general a good update and i hope we don't need to go through other server issues until we see all these working.
That's all so far.


I noted comments to your points above.

-Andrew

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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:48 pm 
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kelden wrote:
Well don't I feel noobish coming here with my second post ever, oh well. Most Kong players don't come to the bd.com forums, heck they barely use the BD forums on Kong so I figured I might as well voice some complaints. I am not claiming this is everyones opinion, but it feels fairly consistent amongst the top (ie usually most active) players.

1) The resource limit - it's my understanding that the resource limit was always supposed to be in place. It is however extremely frustrating, let's assume I have a decent income of 2000/tick, so I'd need to log on every 7 ticks.

1 tick world - Every 7 hours.
2 tick world - Every 3 hrs 30 mins.
3 tick world - Every 2 hrs 20 mins.
6 tick world - Every 1 hr 10 mins.


Sure I can increase the limit to 30000, which I usually do because I hate micromanaging the resources but that would still mean sleeping for less than 2 1/2 hours on a speed world and less than 5 hours on a 3 tick world. This is assuming I have 2000 per tick, it's not hard to have a larger income that that.
2000 metal/tick is not realistic, only a handful will ever achieve that kind of production. However I see your point about the resource cap in the faster worlds and will look at increasing it moderately.

2) Training limit - this is just incredibly silly. When I first noticed the limit I figured - hey maybe I can build more barracks like in other games! Nope, I couldn't. I see absolutely no logic behind this decision, the only thing it achieves game play wise is making heavies even worse. I can now train 90 inf compared to 10 heavies. Sorry but hindering boosters is hardly an issue, you can still rush units or just wait 2 ticks. If you want to spam ranged, that's 6000 per squad without overhead. If you boost you can make 46000 over 144 ticks, that averages out to ~320 per tick. Sure it might hinder them slightly, but they can still rush.
A limit to training units is going to go in, however the current limit is most likely going to be tweaked.

3) Advisors and music - Ooooh pretty shiny new toys! Though they are fairly pointless, I'd rather see new features that actually add things (like the long wanted global vacation) or fixing bugs which bring me to my next point.
We focused primarily on bugs in this update but still there was some new things that went in, it's not only about fixing bugs :)

4) Bugs - I managed to reproduce the wreck bug pretty much instantly. I managed to select a colony in vacation though I haven't managed to with a missile. Might be that I just gave up, it's a bother with a mousepad.
Which wreck bug are you referring to? Also colonies can still be selected when on vacation but cannot have nukes/squads launched at them.

5) Achievements - Meh, would be nice if they worked but doesn't really matter. It's pretty cool having 300+ power and rank 1 without having conquered a single colony.
Achievements are being looked into, this was a bug that happened after the merge.

In both the worlds I'm playing I had a member doing pretty well, rank 1 on M1 and rank 3 on M3. The second he realised the changes he quit the alliances and asked us to conquer him, his reason? The change of focus from strategy to micromanagement. The real change this update presents is really rewarding those that are active.

Sure some might say this is a good thing, that it shouldn't be a hobby you can spend just a couple of minutes every day on. I find this mindset quit boggling, so good players that are low on time shouldn't have a chance? Is the game only for people with no other time consuming responsibilities? I am fairly sure I read somewhere that this game was supposed to be something you could log on once or twice a day and still do decently. When did that goal change?

Maybe I'm stupid but I'd rather see changes that enhances game play or fixes the bugs properly. If that can't achieved, couldn't at least the units be balanced?
BD is designed as a game that can be played and succeed in by casual gamers without having to sink hours a day into it. As stated above the unit limit is something that is going to be tweaked a bit till we find a good balance but a limit will be in place as it is needed for proper game balance.

The game changes all the time and we listen carefully to the feedback that we get, but keep in mind that trying to please everyone results in pleasing no one. We try to stick to our vision for the game and update it/improve it as we think the game should be while simultaneously listening and applying the feedback we get from players. We do listen to virtually all feedback regardless if we implement it or not.


Comments listed above in green

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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:49 pm 
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psg188 wrote:
I have an idea to compromise about the 30 infantry build limit.

The reason behind it is so that someone can't make 100 tanks if someone is eta6 to your colony and have them all finish right when the attack gets there without him being ever able to scan to see your units. If you want to do this you should have to pay a lot in rushed workers. It also makes it easy to balance how much a player is able to relocate with in their base.

To compensate, we should increase the capacity of the Training Base to 90 or maybe 120. Since it doesn't relocate, and problems with rushing are not as severe, I don't see why we can't increase the available recruiting power here. This would provide use to keeping a training base near your colony rather than waiting until you can build one far away.


Love this idea and will be considering it when looking into balancing the new unit limit. Today I'll be looking at all the feedback and tomorrow I'll be making recommendations for changes to the programmers.

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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:50 pm 
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rockhead wrote:
Um major problem here i attacked a guy and conquered him and instead of my units returing to mu outpost they stayed on the guy like i was sending the units to him not attacking him


Please report all the data about this such as a timeline of events, where you attacked from, any error messages you got, etc. to the admin of the world this happened on so we can investigate.

Also if anyone else is experiencing such issues please report it to the admin of the world it happened on so we can track this bug.

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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:53 pm 
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Zudamar wrote:
ok for the training

my opinion, that unlimited = bad yes I can agree to that
but I think 30 units is too harsh of a cut and it should be either 60 or 90


Yep the unlimited was bad for game balance but the new unit limit seems to be a bit too far. The unit limit was my doing so make sure your grievances about it are directed at me and not the other developers :). I expected it to get negative reactions initially but also know that it is for the better of the game to have a limit on training. As I stated in my previous post I'll be looking over this feature carefully today and tomorrow, reading the feedback and tomorrow will recommend tweaks to our programmers.

-Andrew

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 Post subject: Re: Updates! July 1st, 2010
PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 1:07 pm 
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Hey the new voting system is not that good =\. doesent let you know when the votes cooldown. i was 8 votes away from my crystal before update after update i voted and my count stayed the same and i voted all 12.

also whats up with raising the prices on the packages of tokens and not raising the tokens you receive?

~Willirob

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M2- rank 8


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