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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 1:49 pm 
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BatataK wrote:
I think there's not such thing as atheist people. Every single one who doesn't believe in nothing, is no longer in this world, everyone lives as long as they believe in anything, whatever it is. Christians, catholics, muslims and judes, most of them criticize people with their own belief.

Every single person believes in something (most of us believes in what our parents told us to believe or what they told us not to believe, :P ). It doesn't matter if we follow our belief strictly or not. Atheistm does not exist. Even an nihilistic like Nietzche believed in something (the "Übermensch", the "Superman").


I believe you are beginning to confuse atheism with nihilism. You should google them. You will find the differences

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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 1:57 pm 
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GerberBaby1 wrote:
I believe you are beginning to confuse atheism with nihilism. You should google them. You will find the differences


See? everyone believes in something(?)

Not confusing, atheism doesn't exist. I don't confuse nihilism (denial of god and superior objectives) with atheism, as I cannot confuse "something" with "nothing".


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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:02 pm 
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Bata, you seem to be operating under the idea that Atheists don't believe in 'anything'

Generally, you'll find that an Atheist doesn't believe in a deity/series of deities/hoier powers. They still generaly believe in everything else. If you give an Atheist an apple, they'll likely accept that it does exist.

Also, the idea that believing in nothing would make a person 'vanish' seems odd to me. If I didn't believe anything around me existed then I'm sure I'd lead a somewhat confused lifestyle, but I'd still continue to exist.

As an example, I am an agnostic, so you could argue that when it comes to debates about the existence of a higher power, I truly believe in nothing.

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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:29 pm 
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Tom wrote:
Bata, you seem to be operating under the idea that Atheists don't believe in 'anything'

Generally, you'll find that an Atheist doesn't believe in a deity/series of deities/hoier powers. They still generaly believe in everything else. If you give an Atheist an apple, they'll likely accept that it does exist.

Also, the idea that believing in nothing would make a person 'vanish' seems odd to me. If I didn't believe anything around me existed then I'm sure I'd lead a somewhat confused lifestyle, but I'd still continue to exist.

As an example, I am an agnostic, so you could argue that when it comes to debates about the existence of a higher power, I truly believe in nothing.


Hi there.

I do believe that atheists wouldn't believe in anything.

If they believe in everything else, that make them believers, no matter what's the belief object. An atheist, as I learned, doesn't believe in anything. ¿What's the point of being alive if I don't believe in anything?

About the apple and any corporeal thing: I do believe that tangible things exist. I'm not talking about not believing that there's no sun or there's nothing around me. Everything around me exists. When you say:

"If I didn't believe anything around me existed then I'm sure I'd lead a somewhat confused lifestyle, but I'd still continue to exist."

You're saying you believe in nothing around you, meaning that you believe in yourself (that's great, everyone alive believes, at least, in themselves).


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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:45 pm 
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BatataK wrote:
GerberBaby1 wrote:
I believe you are beginning to confuse atheism with nihilism. You should google them. You will find the differences


See? everyone believes in something(?)

Not confusing, atheism doesn't exist. I don't confuse nihilism (denial of god and superior objectives) with atheism, as I cannot confuse "something" with "nothing".


Batatak. Obviously when I told you to look them up you did not.

Atheism according to the Merriam-Webster Dictionary is "a disbelief in the existence of deity"
Nihilism according to the Merriam-Webster Deictionary is "a viewpoint that traditional values and beliefs are unfounded and that existence is senseless and useless "

Now you are saying that atheists don't exist because "everyone believes in something"

Now belief is "conviction of the truth of some statement or the reality of some being or phenomenon especially when based on examination of evidence."

Just because you believe in something does not mean that you believe in god. For instance I believe you are an
Spoiler:
Educated individual
. That doesn't mean that I believe that God or any other deity exists.

Nihilism is the absence of belief in everything. You feel that there is no point in life and want it to end. Think Macbeth near the end of the screenplay. He views life as pointless only seeing the fact that everyone dies. He sees no point in living any longer.

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Last edited by w1lll on Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:54 pm 
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GerberBaby1 wrote:
Nihilism is the absence of belief in everything. You feel that there is no point in life and want it to end. Think Macbeth near the end of the screenplay. He views life as pointless only seeing the fact that everyone dies. He sees no point in living any longer.


Then I confused the word. So, nihilists do not exist.


GerberBaby1 wrote:
Just because you believe in something does not mean that you believe in god. For instance I believe you are an ...... That doesn't mean that I believe that God or any other deity exists.


Didn't get this. I didn't confused "something" with god. If I didn't "google" Atheism and Nihilism, you obviously missunderstood my words or I didn't express good enough (probably). And what was the word edited by will?


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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 5:30 pm 
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Routhy wrote:
Generally, you'll find that an Atheist doesn't believe in a deity/series of deities/hoier powers. They still generaly believe in everything else. If you give an Atheist an apple, they'll likely accept that it does exist.

Sums up pretty much everything.

Atheism has nothing to do with believing in inanimate objects, you simply do not believe that there any deities or higher powers. Why do people always get confused on what atheism even is?

When you ask someone what they believe in, do you honestly expect them to give a straight forward answer? Of course not, the human brain forms beliefs with or without our willing or intending it to. It just happens and is a part of our nature. The question is far too broad and everyone has beliefs for example what Routhy mentioned about the apple. You physically see the apple so your mind automatically believes that the apple is real and present. But this has absolutely nothing to do with atheism.


Quote:
And what was the word edited by will?

I'm guessing that word is something vulgar as he tends to let them slip every so often without thinking that there are moderators lurking all day long.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 6:09 pm 
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BatataK wrote:
And what was the word edited by will?

Anarchist69x wrote:
I'm guessing that word is something vulgar as he tends to let them slip every so often without thinking that there are moderators lurking all day long.


You guessed right but I talk to a bunch of the moderators all the time so they keep me in line so I don't have to moderate myself.

P.S. Ty will :D

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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 1:20 am 
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Quote:
Generally, you'll find that an Atheist doesn't believe in a deity/series of deities/hoier powers. They still generaly believe in everything else. If you give an Atheist an apple, they'll likely accept that it does exist.


Very true. I am an Atheist. I am Christian on paper, but I am an atheist.

Now as far as "belief" goes, I feel, that beliefs can be based on faith (without concrete proof that something is true, or exists, such as the existence of a higher power) or based on fact (like something scientific).

For me Atheism is not a belief, its a fact. I for example am simply not ready to accept the existence of a higher power, simply because you cant see it, and you cant prove it. I believe in evolution and everything that is scientific. Sure there are things that science cant explain even today, but I wouldn't attribute it to being something supernatural. Its simply stuff that we haven't discovered yet.

I am also an atheist because all I ever have seen happen because of "God" or "Religion" is war and misery, over time. I don't think people should really kill each other over something they cant even prove it exists. Yet they do. Another reason why I hate Religion and the principle of a higher power.

I do believe in religious principles like peace, love and brotherhood, who wouldn't? Any good person will. But I am not ready to attribute them as the word of God. They are simply values made up to make civilized living possible.

So summing it up, I am atheist because:

1. My intelligence tells me that God or a higher power is a false concept and based on imagination.

2. People have historically fought over God and religion for a long time. Which is NOT what a "good God" is all about.

3. People who believe in religion tend to ram their beliefs down peoples throat even if the person is not interested. (Certain devout people, quoting scripture and all), which makes me hate it even more.

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 Post subject: Re: Why Are Atheists Atheist?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 6:06 am 
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BatataK wrote:

Hi there.

I do believe that atheists wouldn't believe in anything.

If they believe in everything else, that make them believers, no matter what's the belief object.


Absolutely correct, since Atheists do believe in, for example, the existence of apples. They are, by definition 'believers'.

However, in theological debates, the term 'believer' is generally reserved for those who believe in deities. If you want to use the term believer for somebody who believes in anything then that's fine. Atheists are believers. But that phrase does not mean they believe in a deity when you use it that way.

You have made the mistake of assuming Atheists (and the various branches thereof) do not believe in anything. In fact that simply do not believe in any deities.

I'll draw you a little diagram:

Atheists:
Belief in God : No
Belief in Apples (etc) : Yes (usually)

Christians:
Belief in God : Yes
Belief in Apples (etc) : Yes (usually)

Atheism means they do not believe in God, it does not mean they do not believe in anything. There are many, many people who believe in Apples but not God. Therefore, Atheists exist.

It seems to me that you mistook the meaning of Atheism to mean that they do not believe in anything. also, as I mentioned earlier, if somebody did not believe anything exists, they would not just vanish. They would continue to exist. So even if somebody believed in nothing, they would still exist.

tl;dr - Yes, Atheists do have belief. But not in any deities, including the Christian God. People like this do exist, contrary to your belief.

Quote:
¿What's the point of being alive if I don't believe in anything?


To enjoy your life?

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