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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 8:43 pm 
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There is just some stuff with Ron Paul I do not agree with, for example: He talked about legalizing all drugs because the gov. shouldn't choose what we put in our bodies, and if there is a natural disaster that the town should deal with it, not the country.

Other than that I love Ron Paul, and I have been putting up signs for him downtown for a while.

Seth, just to make it clear, I like Ron Paul. (Thats kinda why I made this topic a while ago.)

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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:06 pm 
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Well considering I am strongly in favor of a socialist government instead of a democracy. I actually like and support the NDAA bill, people may have fantasies of peace in the world but that won't happen. As long as we have certain idiots and puppets of large industries in the senate we are at a disadvantage. We can't let the large public vote. While a few may be educated enough to make the correct decisions the majority are not. Just think how stupid the AVERAGE american is!

Now what do you think of when I inform you that 50% of Americans are even more stupid then that.

It is disgracing and embarrassing that what should be a world power and we are held from that by cooprperate controlling our government.


Thats absolute nonsense Gerber. Lemme ask you something, you prefer a socialist government instead of a democracy. What do you know about a socialist government? Have you lived in a country with socialist policies? Lemme tell you this. Since India was socialist before 1990 and then ran into a balance of payments crisis. Had to airlift 60,000 tons of gold, just to stop the country from defaulting. FFS. Its HORRIBLE. Its great now after India became a market based economy.

I am sitting here 20000 miles away and this bill is disconcerting to me. Tomorrow you can be detained and put in jail indefinitely and hey there wont be anything you can do about it. Sounds good? Who are you to decide that the public is dumb and should not vote? This is not about a country being number 1, it is about a country full of people leading a peaceful and happy existence with a sense of security. Secondly, its not "some" puppets from the corporate world you have, its these corporates that operate your government. THAT is the major problem. Cheney, Rumsfeld, Bush you name it. All corporate leaders and politicians. Making billions out of illegal wars.

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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:43 am 
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lets face it if I decided to tolerate living in america, I would be a better candidate then all of your current ones
infact I think an infant may do a better job...

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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:14 am 
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Mfreak, your using a non sequitur, it's faulty logic. look at Greece and Ireland both of their economies have completely tanked and Greece has almost defaulted twice and has needed even more money.

Socialism is a better form of government. People in mass are stupid and shouldn't have any affect on our government. The only issue with socialism becomes how and who is chosen as the leader.

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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:22 am 
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Mfreak, your using a non sequitur, it's faulty logic. look at Greece and Ireland both of their economies have completely tanked and Greece has almost defaulted twice and has needed even more money.

Socialism is a better form of government. People in mass are stupid and shouldn't have any affect on our government. The only issue with socialism becomes how and who is chosen as the leader.


You cannot compare Greece and Ireland with the united states. The amount of resources that the US has at its disposal is in another league compared to these two countries. Socialism is bad. They will tell you what to manufacture, how much to manufacture, where to sell it and how much to sell it for. People as a group might be stupid, but thats the case every time. So what do you prefer a dictatorship? Thats even worse. The thing is democracy is the worst form of government, but its the best we got.

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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 3:24 pm 
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mfreak wrote:
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Mfreak, your using a non sequitur, it's faulty logic. look at Greece and Ireland both of their economies have completely tanked and Greece has almost defaulted twice and has needed even more money.

Socialism is a better form of government. People in mass are stupid and shouldn't have any affect on our government. The only issue with socialism becomes how and who is chosen as the leader.


You cannot compare Greece and Ireland with the united states. The amount of resources that the US has at its disposal is in another league compared to these two countries. Socialism is bad. They will tell you what to manufacture, how much to manufacture, where to sell it and how much to sell it for. People as a group might be stupid, but thats the case every time. So what do you prefer a dictatorship? Thats even worse. The thing is democracy is the worst form of government, but its the best we got.


You can compare them, what do all three have in common? Democracies who's economies are tanking. There has been talk about wether or not the US should default on our debts but no need to as of yet. We will default on them in the future just as I am positive Greece will as well. My main point about them is that you were comparing all socialist countries to India and that since India's economy failed then all socialist economies fail, which is what your implying when in reality. Democratic countries as a whole have been worse off economically.

Government telling people what to make, where to sell it and how much to sell it for. I call that structure and efficiency. Its how it should be. I am confident the US would not have to bail out all of these US companies if we had a socialist regime. The general public in our country as a whole are too stupid to think and manage things as a whole.

Look at some of the things our US government has allowed to go under this democracy.
1. Almost nothing gets accomplished
    do to bipartisan differences neither will compromise for the sake of the greater good
2. We allow NAMBLA to exist and other organizations like it to under free speech
    Check out their website and then read the titles they have for some stories. It is disturbing and sickening and should not be legal
3. Poor treatment of military veterans
    We allow the majority of our veterans to lay homeless on the streets or suffer with psychological issues. The majority of the homeless are in fact US veterans.
4. Uneven distribution of wealth
    Under a dictatorship done right there will be an even distribution

There are a lot of other things that I am too lazy to write more.

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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 3:27 pm 
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in terms if ideal government socialism is better, but due to greed and other human aspects it doesn't work...

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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 3:29 pm 
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demonlord wrote:
in terms if ideal government socialism is better, but due to greed and other human aspects it doesn't work...


I agree, it depends entirely on the leader.

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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:07 am 
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You can compare them, what do all three have in common? Democracies who's economies are tanking. There has been talk about wether or not the US should default on our debts but no need to as of yet. We will default on them in the future just as I am positive Greece will as well. My main point about them is that you were comparing all socialist countries to India and that since India's economy failed then all socialist economies fail, which is what your implying when in reality. Democratic countries as a whole have been worse off economically.


That is not the case. These three democracies are tanking because the world economy is slowing down. In a market based economy, your economy heavily depends on the markets. There will be slowdowns. You just have to outlast it. How do you think America became so rich? Through Socialism? When america was prosperous and doing well no one complained. But the economy goes down and every starts to want socialism. lol.

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Government telling people what to make, where to sell it and how much to sell it for. I call that structure and efficiency. Its how it should be. I am confident the US would not have to bail out all of these US companies if we had a socialist regime. The general public in our country as a whole are too stupid to think and manage things as a whole.


That is neither structure nor efficiency. Indian companies used to run into losses and finally shut down. Then there used to be a very large public sector. With the government manufacturing everything. Result - poor quality stuff that people didnt wanna buy. So the government used to still continue operating at a loss.That is not efficiency by any means. Finally if Socialism is adopted, you all will have to learn to accept a lower standard of living, lower salaries. Are you prepared to do that? And maybe pay more taxes. I dont think most Americans will agree.

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Look at some of the things our US government has allowed to go under this democracy.
1. Almost nothing gets accomplished
do to bipartisan differences neither will compromise for the sake of the greater good


Change will happen, often slowly. In a socialist government, nothing will get accomplished either. Simply because the whole burden of doing something will be on the government. There will be widespread corruption and nothing will ever get done.

Quote:
2. We allow NAMBLA to exist and other organizations like it to under free speech. Check out their website and then read the titles they have for some stories. It is disturbing and sickening and should not be legal


They can say whatever they want. Be a pedophile or not. Everyone has to be able to speak their mind and not be controlled just because you think they are wrong.

Quote:
3. Poor treatment of military veterans
We allow the majority of our veterans to lay homeless on the streets or suffer with psychological issues. The majority of the homeless are in fact US veterans.


You think in socialist countries war veterans are treated like heroes? You are mistaken. The US probably takes better care of their war veterans than other countries. Even if they dont, its not much different from anywhere else.

Quote:
4. Uneven distribution of wealth
Under a dictatorship done right there will be an even distribution


A dictatorship will result in wealth being usurped by the dictator himself.

The primary issue in my view is income inequality. And I think this is what the guys in Occupy wall street are trying to fix. The problem with that idea is that there is always gonna be income inequality as long as you have competition. What one should concentrate more on is to INCREASE income. Income is directly proportional to education. How many people in the US go to college after school? I have met many on Battledawn for example, who are 17, their girlfriend is pregnant and they have to drop out of school and work at Wendys to provide for their kids. How will these guys improve in life? Its ridiculous. Ever wondered why most Israelis are so well off and infact top most fields? Why every Indian American in the US is richer than the average american? Especially in the most important areas of Finance, Software and high technology jobs and research? Its because they place a lot of emphasis on education. Entrepreneurship especially technological entrepreneurship, research and engineering and most of all emphasis on education in these fields is what will churn out qualified, urbanized individuals that will be able to sell themselves for more. The problem that should be of concern is why most people dont emphasize on education but protest because a few who worked hard and studied hard have all the money!.

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 Post subject: Re: Ron Paul
PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:24 am 
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GerberBaby, Like mfreak said earlier, it isn't about a country being #1, its about the sense of security knowing that the leader you voted into office (at least the majority did) will hear your voice/majority's.

Its about freedom, if you don't like it move. If you don't want freedom then be my guest and go wherever the hell you want to, because you can and
that's what the United States is about, it has had its hardships in recent years but if it wasn't for bailouts, and Bush/Obama the Economy would have balanced out naturally. (Like it usually does in a capitalist system)

Also the debt would have never gotten so bad if it wasn't for government becoming bigger and bigger in the first place! Government ran programs are bankrupting the country and you want more of that? XD

In a perfect world socialism and communism would work great, but there is no perfect world. There is always a bad guy waiting in line for his turn, and the people voting is the best check to make sure we don't get a lunatic leading us.

^ My 2 cents :P

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