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 Post subject: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 11:24 pm 
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is it just racism in disguise?

are hispanics the new african americans?

for those that dont know, the newly presented legislation means people in arizona, particularly (by particularly, i mean ONLY) hispanics must carry immigration documents or they can be arrested by police. IMO, it isnt even subtle at how they are legalizing racial profiling.

so until august, im pretty sure this legislation will get attacked constantly.

your opinion?

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 Post subject: Re: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Sun Apr 25, 2010 8:16 pm 
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So many ways to argue against it. So few to argue for it.

Its an attempt to get immigration under control. If they would rewrite a few lines on it, it wouldn't be so bad.

In any case I doubt, it'll make it past the state Supreme Court. It opens the state and police open to far too many lawsuits.

The ACLU will probably open a permanent office in Arizona just for this legislation.

Then again I didn't think it would make it past the governor. Besides I don't think states can write their own immigration policies into law.

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 Post subject: Re: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Sun Apr 25, 2010 10:05 pm 
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I'm for it, idrc. no one who is white, black, or Asian will be sneaking into the US from Mexico. If the hispanics do not like it, they can move.

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 Post subject: Re: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Mon Apr 26, 2010 6:17 am 
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i were thinking "not even UndeadAngel or Apollo would be loved enough to argue against this =P

so you are ok with it being just them who have to carry their immigration documents or they will be thrown out, but if i sneak into the country and walk right next to him s/he would be checked but not me and could end up in jail because of it?

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 Post subject: Re: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Mon Apr 26, 2010 11:54 pm 
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UndeadAngel wrote:
I'm for it, idrc. no one who is white, black, or Asian will be sneaking into the US from Mexico. If the hispanics do not like it, they can move.

First of all, you are wrong, and it looks like you sit on your house all day watching tv as you have no education what so ever on this.

Spoken like a true white supremacist.

I love racist so much, i can just picture them saying. F..... Hispanics, god i hate them so much. They could just move.

If you really think this way, then you really don't belong in America, you have no idea of its roots or how it came to be. Its people like you on why the world thinks America is ignorant, its people that you that will never ever progress much in life because of such ideals.

I don't mind your opinion but when you have nothing to support a statement other than they can move, you show true ignorance and seem that literature has not reach or will ever reach your mind.


As for the bill, I'm not Hispanic, I'm Mexican get that through your illiterate head. This is racism all over. Personally I'm up for a better immigration law, but not unconstitutional laws like this ones. I do agree America needs a better patrol on illegal immigrants but not by following examples as the white brother on top. (forgive me if your not white, but you talk like a true white racist)

There has to be a better way other than "hey look hes brown lets ask him for his papers."

If you do not think this is the case, then you truly have no knowledge on this issue.

They said "we are not discriminating". Such BS.

Like they would really pull over some white dude.

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 Post subject: Re: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 2:59 pm 
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It's poorly written but all bills are. I believe that day laborers etc and all illegals shouldn't be here in the first place. I'm all for immigration but this isn't even an immigration bill, it's an attempt at a "let us kick out illegals so we can attempt to balance our deficits and reduce crime by cartel members illegally in the states". Will I boycott Arizona no and I'm all for it. The issue is of course, legal hispanics being treated unfairly. If I got stopped and asked to prove my citizenship I wouldn't care.

Lets play the racial profiling? As a teenager I got pulled over almost every single day, occasionally twice a day because I drove a 69' lemans and closed at 2 different jobs in high school. So I got pulled over, light shined in eyes and often forced to take sobriety tests. Was I going to sue no, I'd rather get pulled over than watch someone I know die driving drunk or due to a drunk driver.

If we want someone in the country, lets help them be a citizen, if not lets kick them out. The politicians are too afraid to do anything on immigration because they want the hispanic vote and the majority vote. Most people in Arizona support immigration laws that are very tough, the latino community doesn't, the mexicans living in america community doesn't.

I applaud them for writing a bill that won't be popular with the media(which is left biased). Don't read that I applaud the bill itself. Without reading every provision which I doubt anyone of these forums has done I doubt I can't as of now make an informed decision on the bill. I'm going to say that it isn't racist but is classified as such since latinos/hispanics will be the negative beneficiary of the bill. If we want to falsely compare it is similar to taxing tanning, which is racist toward white people as we're pasty beacons of light when the sun shines.

What many fail to comprehend is that most americans are all for hispanics, mexican cubans puerto ricans that are here legally. We don't like people who are living here illegally and I can go onto the many reasons if desired. Not to mention safety concerns and the allowance of gangs and cartel activites as illegals are out of reach of the law for protection often allowing horrible attrocities to occur. If an illegal is raped they won't be reporting it, but more likely a gang war or shooting will occur. Illegals are a problem and while this bill probably isn't a very good one, a line has to be drawn at some point allowing citizenship to working illegals in america while removing the rest.

Now even allowing them citizenship Social Security Obama Care NIT welfare etc will wreak havoc on already uncontrolled deficits. This is where the rage or racism is based upon for most. However there are just as many socially depenant whites, just a lower percentage. Had more of the latino community been here legally in the first place overall they'd rank higher in education crime etc. If anything it's our fault for allowing them here in the first place. Partisan politics has created the problem and it isn't going to solve them.

If this bill eliminates more illegals off the streets than it alienates hispanics who are here legally creating no problems then it is a good bill. If it does more hard than good then clearly this is a bad bill and I'm betting that 99% of the people "telling" us what this bill is are using no facts to back up their claim.

Hmm did I answer the question...... I doubt it :evil:

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 Post subject: Re: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:16 pm 
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That's an answer i was expecting and i have to agree on you on almost every point.


Now lets look at it in the Young perspective, your 13 and have lived here all almost all your life. You weren't born here. What happens when they get you or your parents and your left alone to wonder off in some country that you have never seen or remember ever living in?
Even worse, left to wonder without your family cause they got deported?

We have to look at it in all perspectives not just money wise.

isn't that unfair to the child?

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 Post subject: Re: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:43 pm 
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patzz wrote:
That's an answer i was expecting and i have to agree on you on almost every point.


Now lets look at it in the Young perspective, your 13 and have lived here all almost all your life. You weren't born here. What happens when they get you or your parents and your left alone to wonder off in some country that you have never seen or remember ever living in?
Even worse, left to wonder without your family cause they got deported?

We have to look at it in all perspectives not just money wise.

isn't that unfair to the child?


It is no more or less unfair than a kid growing up with an alcoholic father or crack head mother. Their parents chose to have the child in a place they resided illegally, I won't go into the right to birth. Personally I'd be all for birthing licenses of a sort no matter how orwelian it is, as many children perhaps most, are not raised in productive home environments. Either the kid goes back with his parents or he has an option to become a citizen if he was born here, perhaps has friends relatives or the social welfare system that they can choose to stay. It would be up to the parents/social workers I believe to decide what is in the best interest of the child.

Most of these children are the cause of the crime. As their parents came here and work hard but their children have no work ethic, can't find a job, may not receive any schooling so they turn to a life of crime. They can blame the system, the man, or whitey for this but it is their parents fault.

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 Post subject: Re: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Sat May 01, 2010 2:06 am 
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Whaddup

Quote:
If I got stopped and asked to prove my citizenship I wouldn't care.

and if you were harrassed daily because of your skin tone, thats completely cool with you, its completely fine that racial profiling is given the green light by police. lets create rifts between legal latino citizens and law enforcement and ultimately endanger communities since the people in uniform might suspect you are illegal.

unless the police ask for papers detailing the legality of caucasians in roughly equal amounts as "brown" skinned peeps, this is racism, plain and simple.

Quote:
If we want someone in the country, lets help them be a citizen, if not lets kick them out.

sure, but does the end justify the means?

Quote:
The politicians are too afraid to do anything on immigration because they want the hispanic vote and the majority vote

there is a difference between introducing methods to combat illegal aliens
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and introducing methods for police to harass people based on skin colour. welcome to democracy really...
btw, illegals cant vote~~ just saying...

Quote:
Most people in Arizona support immigration laws that are very tough, the latino community doesn't, the mexicans living in america community doesn't.

i wonder why the latino community dont support excessive abuse to be used against them based on the colour of their skin....
i wonder...

Quote:
I applaud them for writing a bill that won't be popular with the media(which is left biased).

seriously?... "(which is left biased)"
the aim of writing a bill is not to be unpopular with the media, it is to help the citizens of the state/country. i can write a bill saying that every 4th baby is to be eaten, anyone that disagrees is a dirty liberal and if the media portray it poorly, then it is clearly left biased and under the influence of the USSR. the soviets dont want you to eat babies, BUT I SAY FREEDOM!!!
what utter nonsense to bring to the table. watch some fox news and tell me the media is left biased.

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Without reading every provision which I doubt anyone of these forums has done I doubt I can't as of now make an informed decision on the bill.

you dont need to read every provision. if you have a moderate amount of information on the bill, you can make an informed decision.
i dont know ALL the provisions to ANY bill.

Quote:
I'm going to say that it isn't racist but is classified as such since latinos/hispanics will be the negative beneficiary of the bill.

[legal] latinos/hispanics [citizens] will be the negative beneficiary of the bill.
alright point out how it isnt racist.

Quote:
If we want to falsely compare it is similar to taxing tanning

taxxing cancer pods to balance out the cost of the cancers to the health system is different to targetting people based on the colour of their skin.
very different. one is direct, the person has no choice in the matter, the police do (and these guys are not exempt from corruption/negatives. they are human). the other, non direct, a small minority of the overal caucasion populus would use cancer pods to look tanned, but it is based upon their preference to pay and use them.

Quote:
What many fail to comprehend is that most americans are all for hispanics, mexican cubans puerto ricans that are here legally. We don't like people who are living here illegally and I can go onto the many reasons if desired.

no duh. other then some racists, its perfectly fine. USA is a cultural soup like australia. and again, illegals are illegal for a reason, they are often detrimental to society for the most part. (although they do bring the Arizona agriculture 4.7 billion since cheap labour is cheap labour)

i dont understand the next paragraph, i speak english only sorry. something something obamacare, trying to say that illegals get welfare? strange, something something, something... fgsdfgfdsshhtssfdg

Quote:
I'm betting that 99% of the people "telling" us what this bill is are using no facts to back up their claim.

99%? thats a good bet IMO. you are on, my paypal is located over here....

Quote:
They can blame the system, the man, or whitey for this but it is their parents fault.

there is a term used in DotA when you are about to get ganked and killed
"care"
as in, be careful about where you going because shiz has been spotted there.
thin line between generalisation and outright hate.

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 Post subject: Re: Arizona's new immigration legislation
PostPosted: Sat May 01, 2010 2:36 am 
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I thought I share this article with you:

WASHINGTON – Backed into a corner by Arizona's tough new immigration law, Democrats and Republicans alike find themselves grappling with a volatile issue neither party wanted to fight over just before important midterm congressional elections.

As lawmakers learned during the last national debate on immigration, in 2007, the issue incites passions across the country, affecting everything from national security to states' rights to racial ambitions and resentments. It's fraught with political minefields.

Thus, President Barack Obama, the Democrats who control Congress and Republicans who are in the minority are doing a delicate dance, mindful not to anger their electoral bases — or independents — on the issue.

Underscoring the careful maneuvering, Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano tried to strike a balance in testimony to Congress on Tuesday, saying, "Continually enhancing border security is not only critical for border communities, but is a necessary part of any comprehensive attempt to fix our nation's broken immigration system to make it work for the 21st century."

The Huffington Post is keeping track of the fallout from the Arizona law in the regularly-updated slideshow below -- scroll through for the latest updates.

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