other then a pathetic outburst, it seems plotter is quiet in what would otherwise be a topic that he would be screaming in.

perhaps he is away... im expecting him to begin ranting how these scientific checks were funded by hippies or seomthing.
anyone have any idea on where plotter is?

this topic hasnt been touched by him in quite a while.

For the first time in my life, I'd say ducky won this arguement. Bask in it Ducky, for i will never say those words again

SIF NOT DEFEND YOUR VIEW!

im not good with basking in glory. i prefer discussion and debates, its a point that is won that is victory, not a post completely conceded and not replied to.. COUGHAPOLLOYOUKNOWWHATIMREFERRINGTOCOUGH

the issue of global warming is one that can easily be ranted on by both sides.
its economy vs environment
and both sides have pluses and minuses

+ So they ignored water vapour because the concentration varies? :/



Yes, but you don't know whether its the global climate change is natural or not, because you don't know quantitively exactly how much carbon dioxide is affecting temperatures, compared to the effect of water vapour.

I'm not going to put the scenarios here coz they're long, but suffice it to say that you're missing the point. I'm not talking about removing all water vapour, I'm contending that water vapour is massively variable and overall is contributing to global climate change a lot more than carbon dioxide. Note the temperature change isn't a steady climb, it goes upppppp then dowwwwwn then upppp again etc, while carbon dioxide levels have just been going up.

then global dimming your face?

global dimming is sulfates or aerosols or soot or something in the atmosphere. these attract water vapor to condense and form droplets, however these droplets are smaller. the smaller droplets reflect more sunlight thereby reducing the effects of global warming as well as evaporation.

and the water vapor is an aspect humans are unable to control. our carbon output is massive and pretty soon the temp would be too high to absorb 30% of our carbon output. CH4 is another problem directly caused by humans. you cant contest that these 2 gases have no aspect in climate change. and yet, humans are a major contributing factor when determining the level of these gases in the atmosphere. primarily forest clearing and aminals. AMINALS****

Global warming is the increase in the average temperature of the Earth's near-surface air and oceans since the mid-20th century and its projected continuation. Global surface temperature increased 0.74 ± 0.18 °C (1.33 ± 0.32 °F) during the last century.[1][A] The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) concludes that increasing greenhouse gas concentrations resulting from human activity such as fossil fuel burning and deforestation are responsible for most of the observed temperature increase since the middle of the 20th century. The IPCC also concludes that natural phenomena such as solar variation and volcanoes produced most of the warming from pre-industrial times to 1950 and had a small cooling effect afterward. These basic conclusions have been endorsed by more than 45 scientific societies and academies of science,including all of the national academies of science of the major industrialized countries.

Climate model projections summarized in the latest IPCC report indicate that the global surface temperature will probably rise a further 1.1 to 6.4 °C (2.0 to 11.5 °F) during the twenty-first century. The uncertainty in this estimate arises from the use of models with differing sensitivity to greenhouse gas concentrations and the use of differing estimates of future greenhouse gas emissions. Some other uncertainties include how warming and related changes will vary from region to region around the globe. Most studies focus on the period up to the year 2100. However, warming is expected to continue beyond 2100 even if emissions stop, because of the large heat capacity of the oceans and the long lifetime of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere.

An increase in global temperature will cause sea levels to rise and will change the amount and pattern of precipitation, probably including expansion of subtropical deserts. The continuing retreat of glaciers, permafrost and sea ice is expected, with warming being strongest in the Arctic. Other likely effects include increases in the intensity of extreme weather events, species extinctions, and changes in agricultural yields.

Political and public debate continues regarding climate change, and what actions (if any) to take in response. The available options are mitigation to reduce further emissions; adaptation to reduce the damage caused by warming; and, more speculatively, geoengineering to reverse global warming. Most national governments have signed and ratified the Kyoto Protocol aimed at reducing greenhouse gas emissions.

I've solved the defintition and therefore means its partly to do with Humans and Sun.

We know for a fact that there is natural global climate change. However, the evidence we have that suggests a much sharper rise since industrialisation - especially with mathematical modeling and evidence pointing to the greenhouse effect.

Graph me?

did i mention this source has a GG in it?
thermal.gg.utah.edu/talks/gould/

seriously, roll over and bow now it has GG!! thats reason enough

Try a longer term graph there.